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587: Have We Been Misreading Romans? With NT Wright

Updated: Oct 19, 2023


World-renowned New Testament scholar N.T. Wright is back! He’s written an entire book about the 8th chapter of Romans, and he talks to Skye about how this chapter and its themes—including glorification and even salvation—are widely misunderstood. Also this week—How over-simplifying the history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict can lead to bad takes about the war in Gaza, including the justification of terrorism and atrocities. David French has a new article explaining why devotion to Trump won’t break among some Christians, leading Kaitlyn and Skye to debate the roles of reason and emotion in politics. And Phil refuses to talk about a bear that stole a frozen lasagna



Holy Post Plus:

NT Wright Debrief with Glenn Packiam

https://www.patreon.com/posts/91173267


0:00 - Intro


1:29 - Show starts


1:56 - Theme Song


2:20 - Sponsor - Faithful Counseling

Get 10% off your first month at Faithful Counseling.com/HOLYPOST


3:31 - Show resumes


7:38 - Latest thoughts on the Israel and Hamas War


32:04 - Advice on how to think about the conflict


38:49 - Why the Trump Fever won’t break



55:30 - Sponsor - Moody Publishing - Pick up your copy of “Just Show Up” by Drew Dyck today at Moodypublishers.com or wherever fine books are sold.



56:37 - Sponsor - Go to hiyahealth.com/HOLYPOST to receive 50% off your first order


57:46 - Interview Intro


1:02:42 - The Gospel according to Paul


1:16:52 - Lament


1:25:44 - Romans 8:28


1:38:15 - End Credits



Links mentioned in news segment:


Conflict in Israel and Palestine: Crash Course World History


The Israel-Palestine conflict: a brief, simple history


The Progressives Who Flunked the Hamas Test


Opinion | One Reason the Trump Fever Won’t Break




Other resources:


Into the Heart of Romans: A Deep Dive into Paul's Greatest Letter by NT Wright


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16 Comments


chastmastr
Oct 25, 2023

If our reason is mainly used to justify our emotions, if I am hearing you right about the elephant and rider, then surely that claim is just as suspect as any other notion, and therefore just as unreliable? But that cuts off the branch that the claim is sitting on. One would think that Haidt had never had to fight his emotions in favor of his reason. I agree with C.S. Lewis and the traditional Christian notion that right and wrong are not apart from reason, but part of it--practical reasoning. We may do it imperfectly, but that doesn't make it irrational or arational at all. More on practical reason: https://iep.utm.edu/prac-med/

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Terry Ann Roth
Terry Ann Roth
Oct 21, 2023

I do appreciate the approach the HP has taken over the last two episodes regarding the situation in Israel. Thank you for the nuanced (Skye's favorite word) approach and reminding us about the need to have compassion for the innocent Palestinians. I also I appreciate how Skye pointed out on one of the episodes that we live in a world where we are forced into taking a side and you can't do that in a complicated situation like this. Finally I appreciate Skye's encouragement to look into the very complicated history with Palestine and Israel. If anyone is interested there is a 2015 PBS documentary - 1913:The Seeds of Conflict I highly recommend as a starting point.

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sbsalzer
sbsalzer
Oct 21, 2023

I have heard Dr. Wright refer more than once to the Psalms as the church's songbook. Does anyone have recommendations for musicians who have done that well? Or even musical artists who have crafted songs of lament?

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S R
S R
Oct 21, 2023
Replying to

Jonathan Ogden occasionally sings the Psalms. His version of Psalm 27 is beautiful.

Edited
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Joshua Turpin
Joshua Turpin
Oct 20, 2023

MLK was very clear that nonviolence was a strategy, not a moral (although with moral components) and that he regretted not being more forceful. And we now know that the big MLK smackdown of El-Hajj Malik El-Shabazz (Malcolm X) was made up by a journalist who moved MLK’s words around (https://www.npr.org/2023/05/15/1175833143/mlk-martin-luther-king-jr-malcolm-x-quote-biography). You shouldn’t misrepresent MLK to back up your own position. In addition, Fred Hampton was very clear that the people in power always call for nonviolent protest and use it against movements as a form of respectability politics. However, as soon as we are nonviolent, they say that we are pushing too much and need to back off. Just look at the response to the BLM protests. All th…

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Tim Melton
Tim Melton
Oct 23, 2023
Replying to

True that King advocated a more forceful approach toward the end of his life, especially in light of how white liberals tended to disappear when tension escalated. However, King never capitulated to the violence that X promoted in his early years. In fact, the opposite is true. After leaving The Nation of Islam, X began to see the importance of love and non-violence as a more potent weapon against evil.

Edited
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NickAdamsMI
Oct 20, 2023

An informative geographical/historical examination that ties into current political implications:

https://unchartedterritories.tomaspueyo.com/p/will-israel-be-at-war

https://unchartedterritories.tomaspueyo.com/p/who-can-claim-palestine

https://unchartedterritories.tomaspueyo.com/p/do-arab-states-support-palestine

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